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Daycare Center and Family Home Forum>Do I Have To Serve Milk?
Unregistered 12:54 PM 03-27-2017
I have a family whose child will be 1 in april. I told them that once he turns 1, I no longer allow formula and he will be switched to cows milk. They asked if I can just give him water, because they are not milk drinkers at home. No allergy or religious reasons; just because. Im not on the food program but I know in licensing you still have to serve balanced meals. Do I have to give him milk or is water fine?
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CityGarden 12:58 PM 03-27-2017
My dd never had milk.... I think it is odd humans drink another mammals milk, no other mammal on earth does this.

Not sure how that impacts your license though.
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Blackcat31 12:59 PM 03-27-2017
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
I have a family whose child will be 1 in april. I told them that once he turns 1, I no longer allow formula and he will be switched to cows milk. They asked if I can just give him water, because they are not milk drinkers at home. No allergy or religious reasons; just because. Im not on the food program but I know in licensing you still have to serve balanced meals. Do I have to give him milk or is water fine?
Depends on what your state licensing rules say.
What state are you in?

The food program does allow for alternatives to be served so although you are not on the food program, most still follow the recommended guidelines for meals and snacks.
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Blackcat31 01:00 PM 03-27-2017
Originally Posted by CityGarden:
My dd never had milk.... I think it is odd humans drink another mammals milk, no other mammal on earth does this.

Not sure how that impacts your license though.
Totally off topic but I think it's odd that people use that (bolded) as an example or in support of not drinking cow's milk. Technically no other mammals can do what humans do so....

I don't drink milk myself and have noticed a change in my over all health since I eliminated it from my diet.
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daycare 01:01 PM 03-27-2017
are you on the food program? as BC said, depends on the state.

I am in CA and I can allow for a parent to sign a request to substitute without having to go see a doctor.

Taking the milk out completely won't provide sufficient amount of fat, protein and calories this child needs.

I am vegan, don't even do soy. I don't really do any form of milk, I don't like processed foods/beverages.

BUT I am an adult and make up for it in many other ways...
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Unregistered 01:17 PM 03-27-2017
Yeah i never really understood why people are so against drinking milk when they drink soda, coffee, alcohol, clearly things that are worse for you to consume...
We eat the cows rump, why not its milk! Lol
Im in MN btw.
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Blackcat31 01:40 PM 03-27-2017
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
Yeah i never really understood why people are so against drinking milk when they drink soda, coffee, alcohol, clearly things that are worse for you to consume...
We eat the cows rump, why not its milk! Lol
Im in MN btw.

MN state regulations say:

9502.0445 WATER, FOOD, AND NUTRITION

Subp. 3. Meals and snacks. Well-balanced meals and snacks must be offered daily.
§A. Food served during the day must include servings from each of the basic food groups as defined by the United States Department of Agriculture's Code of Federal Regulations, title 7, section 226.20.

https://www.revisor.mn.gov/rules/?id=9502.0445


I have a 2 kids that don't really want/like milk but I still need to offer it. They can decline and drink water instead but according to the food program I have to "offer" it.
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daycarediva 01:42 PM 03-27-2017
I have to offer it, they can chose to consume or not.

Are they using soy formula? What does your food program say about a parent note? I had one parent opt out milk and my FP accepted her note.
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Jupadia 03:17 PM 03-27-2017
Sorry just wondering why you would not allow formula. I get it if you provided it but if parents are bringing it why not. I only ask cause I give my own formula still at times. But he also gets milk now at 15 months.
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Leigh 03:42 PM 03-27-2017
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
Totally off topic but I think it's odd that people use that (bolded) as an example or in support of not drinking cow's milk. Technically no other mammals can do what humans do so....

I don't drink milk myself and have noticed a change in my over all health since I eliminated it from my diet.
I've had kittens drinking dog's milk. I'm not a milk drinker, either, but I push it with my son. He's not such a fan, either, but he does like soy milk and cashew milk, so we rotate. As far as the food program, soy is an acceptable substitute if the parent signs a request for it.
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hwichlaz 03:43 PM 03-27-2017
They don't just wake up on their 1st birthday no longer needing formula or breastmilk. Though I can understand if you're no longer willing to provide it at that point. It's still better for them than cow's milk.

But here, even pediatricians recommend a slow transition, starting on the first birthday.

According to the California Healthy Beverages Act of 2007 I can only serve Milk, Water, or one serving per day of 100% fruit juice. If I wasn't on the food program I'd have no problem not serving cow's milk to a child that was off formula and eating an otherwise well balanced diet. But a child that wasn't yet eating well, I'd keep on formula a bit longer.

editing to add: My perspective is that of a parent who's middle child didn't even start solid foods until around his first birthday. He certainly wasn't ready to give up breatmilk or formula at that point...cow's milk would have been completely inappropriate and innadequate as a milk source.
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debbiedoeszip 04:34 PM 03-27-2017
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
I have a family whose child will be 1 in april. I told them that once he turns 1, I no longer allow formula and he will be switched to cows milk. They asked if I can just give him water, because they are not milk drinkers at home. No allergy or religious reasons; just because. Im not on the food program but I know in licensing you still have to serve balanced meals. Do I have to give him milk or is water fine?
Are they ok with him having cheese and yogurt? If so, then I think that him drinking water and not having milk is fine. If not, then I don't think that I'd be comfortable with not serving anything from an entire food group (dairy).
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Unregistered 06:31 PM 03-27-2017
Unless their is a weight gaining issue, formula is no longer needed. It also states on the container up to 12 months. Research shows continued use of bottle and formula can lead to childhood obesity.
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Unregistered 06:37 PM 03-27-2017
My son was done with bottle at 10 months and formula at 11 months. He had most of his teeth already and ate the same full meals I ate. So it was so longer needed. He was in the 95th percentile, he did not need the extra fat from formula.
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Unregistered 06:42 PM 03-27-2017
Yes he eats cheese and yogurt. He is a really good eater, so going off formula will be fine. One of the kids I had was very skinny and didnt eat well, so i allowed toddler formula until he was 15 months and started eating better.
I just wanted to make sure I wouldnt get cited if my licenser saw i wasnt giving him milk. My inspection is coming up!
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EntropyControlSpecialist 05:52 AM 03-28-2017
I AM on the food program, live in the south, and in my state (could be the same everywhere? can't imagine it not being?) you can get a note from the Doctor stating, "Please give Susan water in place of milk."
No allergy reason needed, simply a Doctor's note.

I wonder if a parent note would work as well. The parents who have done this have always had their Doctor do so. My own daughter isn't enrolled in the food program so I don't have a note in her file. Cow's milk is quite gross to me. I just don't give her cow's milk.

I'll ask my food program sponsor when she's here next month.
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Pestle 06:33 AM 03-28-2017
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
Unless their is a weight gaining issue, formula is no longer needed. It also states on the container up to 12 months. Research shows continued use of bottle and formula can lead to childhood obesity.
And if you were the parent, that would be your choice. Every 12mo I've had is still being weaned and I support that. I sent my own child to day care with breast milk until she was 18 months and I would have immediately pulled her from a care provider who took it upon themselves to wean my child.

Originally Posted by Unregistered:
My son was done with bottle at 10 months and formula at 11 months. He had most of his teeth already and ate the same full meals I ate. So it was so longer needed. He was in the 95th percentile, he did not need the extra fat from formula.
Well congratulations on having such an impressive child. Not all kids are on that same track--in fact, 95% of them arent.
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Unregistered 08:08 AM 03-28-2017
Originally Posted by Pestle:
And if you were the parent, that would be your choice. Every 12mo I've had is still being weaned and I support that. I sent my own child to day care with breast milk until she was 18 months and I would have immediately pulled her from a care provider who took it upon themselves to wean my child.



Well congratulations on having such an impressive child. Not all kids are on that same track--in fact, 95% of them arent.
Wondering why you are so upset...this is how I, and many other daycare providers and centers, run their program. If the parents didnt like it, then they wouldnt have signed the contract. What you do in your home with your child is your business, in my home its my business.
Sheesh...
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LostMyMarbles 10:44 AM 03-28-2017
You are not on the good program , I wouldn't worry about it. There are many ways to serve a balanced meal. I'm sure you will do your best.

Have you thought about joining the food program.? If you are all about the balanced thing, you are already meeting food program regulation anyways. It won't be a major change for you and the reimbursement, no matter the size, helps.
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daycarediva 11:21 AM 03-28-2017
I also offered breastmilk (in a sippy cup) well beyond a year. I didn't have big kids (under the growth chart, but eating great), and the pedi said it was great for them.
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Blackcat31 11:29 AM 03-28-2017
Originally Posted by daycarediva:
I also offered breastmilk (in a sippy cup) well beyond a year. I didn't have big kids (under the growth chart, but eating great), and the pedi said it was great for them.
I have 2 DCK's that drink breastmilk.
One is 2 yrs old and the other is a new 4.
Both drink from a cup and no longer nurse.
Mom brings a week supply on Monday each week.
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EntropyControlSpecialist 11:38 AM 03-28-2017
Originally Posted by Pestle:
And if you were the parent, that would be your choice. Every 12mo I've had is still being weaned and I support that. I sent my own child to day care with breast milk until she was 18 months and I would have immediately pulled her from a care provider who took it upon themselves to wean my child.



Well congratulations on having such an impressive child. Not all kids are on that same track--in fact, 95% of them arent.
I can't imagine a provider ever taking away breastmilk from an infant or a toddler. A young child could just never be truly "FAT" off of breastmilk. It's so beneficial and the World Health Organization recommends it until at least age 2.
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Unregistered 11:38 AM 03-28-2017
One and done is the rule at my daycare. Parents can feed how they want at home. Daycare is one and done. I don't like handling breast milk and it's easer to pour milk in to a cup than to mix formula. Doctors here say cows milk one week after the child's first birthday. So unless there is a note from the doctor saying child needs to be on breast milk or formula past 1 yr the one and done rule applies! I have a 3 year old who still gets breast milk at home straight from the tap! Here they drink regular milk out of a cup.
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EntropyControlSpecialist 11:39 AM 03-28-2017
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
I have 2 DCK's that drink breastmilk.
One is 2 yrs old and the other is a new 4.
Both drink from a cup and no longer nurse.
Mom brings a week supply on Monday each week.
I love that you're supportive of that, even if it's different from how you would have done things (or not).

Once I'm able to breastfeed again I'll be putting breastmilk in my daughter's cup. She'll be 4 at the time.
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EntropyControlSpecialist 11:40 AM 03-28-2017
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
One and done is the rule at my daycare. Parents can feed how they want at home. Daycare is one and done. I don't like handling breast milk and it's easer to pour milk in to a cup than to mix formula. Doctors here say cows milk one week after the child's first birthday. So unless there is a note from the doctor saying child needs to be on breast milk or formula past 1 yr the one and done rule applies! I have a 3 year old who still gets breast milk at home straight from the tap! Here they drink regular milk out of a cup.
Do you live in the Unites States? I feel like ya do. Breastfeeding to age 3 (or later) is completely normal in other parts of the world. The US is really weird with the time constraints they place on the "appropriateness" of breastfeeding.
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Blackcat31 11:54 AM 03-28-2017
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
One and done is the rule at my daycare. Parents can feed how they want at home. Daycare is one and done. I don't like handling breast milk and it's easer to pour milk in to a cup than to mix formula. Doctors here say cows milk one week after the child's first birthday. So unless there is a note from the doctor saying child needs to be on breast milk or formula past 1 yr the one and done rule applies! I have a 3 year old who still gets breast milk at home straight from the tap! Here they drink regular milk out of a cup.
What do you mean by that?

I don't handle it any different than I do milk or water.
I'm not playing with it or spilling it on myself so not sure how one "handles" breast milk differently than cow's milk.

Most the food programs don't a Dr to write a note supporting breast milk beyond age 1, it's simply acceptable (because it IS better for them) and in some states, licensing laws require you to observe the parent's wishes concerning breast milk.
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Unregistered 12:33 PM 03-28-2017
Breast milk is a different story. Im simply talking about getting rid of formula after 1 year. It doesnt seem like a huge deal to replace it with regular whole milk. If they want to bring breast milk in containers that is fine. Unfortunately, none of the parents I have breastfed their kids.
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Unregistered 01:34 PM 03-28-2017
I think what she means by handling breast milk differently is that it is a bodily fluid and you need to treat it as such. So wear gloves and keep it in a seperate area/container in the fridge away from other food. At least that is what I was told...
When it comes in those bags it can get messy. When I pumped for my son I hated those things.
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Blackcat31 02:07 PM 03-28-2017
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
I think what she means by handling breast milk differently is that it is a bodily fluid and you need to treat it as such. So wear gloves and keep it in a seperate area/container in the fridge away from other food. At least that is what I was told...
When it comes in those bags it can get messy. When I pumped for my son I hated those things.
Breast milk requires no additional safety measures for handling than formula or milk.

Gloves are not required to be worn when handling breast milk. Just wash your hands before and after.


USDA Food Program rules for handling and storage begin on page 17
https://www.fns.usda.gov/sites/defau...ng_infants.pdf
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Kimskiddos 02:17 PM 03-28-2017
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
Totally off topic but I think it's odd that people use that (bolded) as an example or in support of not drinking cow's milk. Technically no other mammals can do what humans do so....

I don't drink milk myself and have noticed a change in my over all health since I eliminated it from my diet.
Still staying off topic, the bolded part isn't really correct. Because other mammal have adopted and fed babies that were a different species. Dogs or cats raising bunnies, squirrels, foxes etc. It does happen. You could probably youtube videos (to lazy to go check) of different species adopting and feeding babies.

I don't drink milk either.
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Pestle 02:19 PM 03-28-2017
Oh, man. I end every day with a dunk in the tub to scrub other people's body fluids off of me. Wonder if I can convince the fashion industry that drool- and breast milk-jeans are the new acid-wash. (Also: How fast can I strip out of a pair of pants? Not as fast as poop soaks into them, it turns out.)

Only I can't bathe now, because DH is in the tub. He contracted a stomach virus and spent yesterday evening face-down on the living room floor, groaning loudly, because that's how he approaches every ailment. He got a doctor's note this morning, came home, and spent the day quarantined to the bedroom, passed out in bed with his nose mushed onto my laptop, surrounded by Gatorade bottles. I guess he deserves the tub more than I do.
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Pestle 02:22 PM 03-28-2017
Anyway, breast milk is not waste like urine and feces and it's not likely to communicate diseases like blood, so I've never heard of any standard that requires it to be handled with gloves or kept in isolation. Sounds like a case of the heebie-jeebies.
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Blackcat31 02:25 PM 03-28-2017
Originally Posted by Kimskiddos:
Still staying off topic, the bolded part isn't really correct. Because other mammal have adopted and fed babies that were a different species. Dogs or cats raising bunnies, squirrels, foxes etc. It does happen. You could probably youtube videos (to lazy to go check) of different species adopting and feeding babies.

I don't drink milk either.
True!

Originally Posted by Pestle:
Anyway, breast milk is not waste like urine and feces and it's not likely to communicate diseases like blood, so I've never heard of any standard that requires it to be handled with gloves or kept in isolation. Sounds like a case of the heebie-jeebies.
I must concur!

Sending good health vibes to your DH..... being sick definitely sucks! Hope he is feeling better soon!
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mommyneedsadayoff 02:33 PM 03-28-2017
I dont care about the preferred contents (BM, cows milk, almond milk, whiskey)...ok, maybe the last one is meant for my cup All i care about is thr method of delivery. We do sippy cups and regular cups sfter one year, so once that transition happens, i ask for BM to be ready to drink, not frozen. Otherwise, besides juice, i will gladly give the BM in a cup and save myself some money
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Pestle 04:22 PM 03-28-2017
Originally Posted by mommyneedsadayoff:
I dont care about the preferred contents (BM, cows milk, almond milk, whiskey)...ok, maybe the last one is meant for my cup
Did you know that if you toss currants or golden raisins into a small Gladware container and cover them with Kraken spiced rum while you're prepping lunch, they'll be plump and perfect for topping ice cream by the time all the kids are picked up?
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happymom 01:48 PM 03-30-2017
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
I have 2 DCK's that drink breastmilk.
One is 2 yrs old and the other is a new 4.
Both drink from a cup and no longer nurse.
Mom brings a week supply on Monday each week.
Wow, this is really cool. I extend breastfeed my kids but stop pumping when they no longer needed bottles. That's just so neat!
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mommyneedsadayoff 01:51 PM 03-30-2017
Originally Posted by Pestle:
Did you know that if you toss currants or golden raisins into a small Gladware container and cover them with Kraken spiced rum while you're prepping lunch, they'll be plump and perfect for topping ice cream by the time all the kids are picked up?
Grocery list:
rum
raisins
ice cream

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Blackcat31 01:54 PM 03-30-2017
Originally Posted by happymom:
Wow, this is really cool. I extend breastfeed my kids but stop pumping when they no longer needed bottles. That's just so neat!
I think so too! I have had a LOT of families seek out my program because of this. One breast feeding Mama tells her friend and then another and then another.....BEST form of advertising ever!

I don't have a "private room/space" for moms that want to nurse and I haven't really had anyone ask but when they hear that I support and encourage them to use breast milk in a cup even if they've stopped actually nursing, most mom's are thrilled!

I am really trying hard to accommodate things I was either uncomfortable with, unfamiliar with or things that simply weren't the "norm" when I first started out.

I wholeheartedly support cloth diapers too! I actually have a new one starting in a couple weeks and the family used cloth for their oldest but are on the fence about this second one using cloth. I am really really really crossing my fingers that they DO choose to use cloth.
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happymom 02:34 PM 03-30-2017
Fingers crossed for cloth!
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midaycare 05:08 PM 03-31-2017
I'm dairy free. Anti milk. But those are MY personal feelings. When operating a daycare business, I think it's important to go with the norm. I follow the food guidelines set by the WHO and of course, CACFP when dealing with other people's children.

Personally, I stop formula for kids who are ready at age 1 or later - I defer to the doctor and request a note. For breast feeding, I encourage it as long as possible. Not of my moms have made it past 9 months though. Apparently teeth really hurt!

To the original question, if you're not on the food program then yes, do as you please. If you are, check with your representative. I believe you need an appropriate substitute and/or a doctor's note. I have been told the doctor's note must be specific and certain brands of milk won't be accepted.
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Ariana 04:27 PM 04-01-2017
I personally don't drink milk, other than a splash of cream in my coffee but offer it to daycare kids if their parents want them to have it. I would also offer breastmilk or formula. The problem I have is that kids will not drink it here and it all ends up going down the drain
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trix23 07:03 PM 04-01-2017
Once our older son turned 1, we switched him to goats milk. We provided it to his daycare at the time.
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wonderfullisa 03:21 AM 04-03-2017
For a while, my one then 1-year old was the only 1year old. My food program contact asked if he was only drinking whole milk.
Why, yes... he is. My milk is as whole as it gets.
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