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New Members - Welcome to the Daycare.com Forum!>Question On Withholding Food as Punishment
Rnkyl 02:56 PM 06-20-2016
Sore topic, I Know.
Wanted to get others opinion and input on this subject.
Recently my son, Age 4, was at his daycare (Idaho) and according to the staff member there at the time, had an altercation with another child at the facility shortly before lunch time. So far we haven't been able to confirm the altercation, but the facility did confirm that my son was placed in the kitchen with the staff member on duty. The rest of the daycare was served lunch, but my son was not. He was made to sit in the kitchen within view of the other children eating. He stated a number of times that he was hungry and his tummy hurt, and if he could eat.
According to what I had been told, the staff member kept asking "can you make good choices?" They wanted to hear a 'yes' before allowing him to eat (or so I was told). There was no mention of telling my son that he would not be allowed to eat unless he said he can make good choices.
My son kept telling them "no" since obviously he was in trouble so the choice he made was not a good one, thus he answered accordingly. Needless to say, there was no rewording or trying to help him understand.
Simply put, the way I am seeing this is that My child got in trouble and as punishment had food withheld and was forced to watch the other children eat.

I know it varies from state to state, but is this even an acceptable or legal form of punishment for a child in a daycare?
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Blackcat31 03:02 PM 06-20-2016
Originally Posted by Rnkyl:
Sore topic, I Know.
Wanted to get others opinion and input on this subject.
Recently my son, Age 4, was at his daycare (Idaho) and according to the staff member there at the time, had an altercation with another child at the facility shortly before lunch time. So far we haven't been able to confirm the altercation, but the facility did confirm that my son was placed in the kitchen with the staff member on duty. The rest of the daycare was served lunch, but my son was not. He was made to sit in the kitchen within view of the other children eating. He stated a number of times that he was hungry and his tummy hurt, and if he could eat.
According to what I had been told, the staff member kept asking "can you make good choices?" They wanted to hear a 'yes' before allowing him to eat (or so I was told). There was no mention of telling my son that he would not be allowed to eat unless he said he can make good choices.
My son kept telling them "no" since obviously he was in trouble so the choice he made was not a good one, thus he answered accordingly. Needless to say, there was no rewording or trying to help him understand.
Simply put, the way I am seeing this is that My child got in trouble and as punishment had food withheld and was forced to watch the other children eat.

I know it varies from state to state, but is this even an acceptable or legal form of punishment for a child in a daycare?
No. That was NOT an acceptable way in which to handle the situation.

I would schedule a conference with the center director and see what they have to say about it.

A better way to handle it would have been to remove a privilege NOT a requirement.

Perhaps the center can come up with a more appropriate consequence/reaction.
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Mike 03:11 PM 06-20-2016
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
No. That was NOT an acceptable way in which to handle the situation.

I would schedule a conference with the center director and see what they have to say about it.

A better way to handle it would have been to remove a privilege NOT a requirement.

Perhaps the center can come up with a more appropriate consequence/reaction.

I don't think it's acceptable in any state or province.
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snbauser 03:15 PM 06-20-2016
Absolutely not and if it was my kid, he wouldn't be going back. Eating lunch is not a privelige. It is a right. No child should have food withheld for misbehaving. Maybe eating away from the other children but even that might be bordering on shaming the child which isn't allowed here either. In addition, I can guarantee you here that the kitchen is an off limits place for children in a center...supervised or not.
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Rnkyl 03:28 PM 06-20-2016
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
No. That was NOT an acceptable way in which to handle the situation.

I would schedule a conference with the center director and see what they have to say about it.

A better way to handle it would have been to remove a privilege NOT a requirement.

Perhaps the center can come up with a more appropriate consequence/reaction.
This happened last week, Tuesday. After calling and leaving messages at the center and the owner's cellular phone a number of time through the remainder of the week, I finally managed to get a hold of the owner today and have a meeting with them tomorrow morning. Sadly, I'm told the video feed system they have is on a 5 day loop, so being able to see what happened is not a possibility since it records over itself after 5 days. I'm a bit confused and wanted to see the altercation since there is conflicting stories between what staff says and what my son and daughter says. Did talk to them separately to see if their story was the same.

As far as the center's response is concerned, they expelled him that day. The staff present that day is on vacation and hadnt put a written report in. This and the lack of video feed is concerning to me, because the side of the story that I am hearing from my children is that another child provoked my son by pushing him in his face and that the staff member was rather rough and slammed my child down in a chair hard enough that the other children could hear it from the other room. He did have some light pressure marks on his legs that faded the next day.

I am trying not to jump to conclusions and make a determination without all the facts present, but it does seem a bit convenient that I couldn't get in touch with the owner/manager until after the video loop 5 day time passed and the staff member is on vacation, but only gave a verbal report and not a written.
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Rnkyl 03:35 PM 06-20-2016
Originally Posted by snbauser:
Absolutely not and if it was my kid, he wouldn't be going back. Eating lunch is not a privelige. It is a right. No child should have food withheld for misbehaving. Maybe eating away from the other children but even that might be bordering on shaming the child which isn't allowed here either. In addition, I can guarantee you here that the kitchen is an off limits place for children in a center...supervised or not.
I heard this as well the other day that the kitchen is an off limits place for children in a center. Whenever there seems to be an issue with my child (dont know about anyone elses child there) they would segregate and take him into the kitchen. I didnt think this was very safe to begin with, but also the kitchen is the one area that does not have a camera covering it. My field is in behavioral psychology and as such, being able to review the video and observe my son's behavior and actions before, during, and afterwards would give great insight into the issue. It would show what triggers there were, how he handled himself, etc.
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Thriftylady 03:39 PM 06-20-2016
I would pull my child if I was concerned. I would like to see the video, and would wonder if they put off my calls so I couldn't. Had they handled the concerns in a timely manner, it could be easily cleared up. It is never okay to withhold a meal. Now having a child eat away from the group, maybe. I have had a child do that when they couldn't behave within the group. But not feeding the child is a definite no. I don't see how it matters who "started" the disagreement the children were in. Sometimes kids need broken up for awhile. But basic needs should always be met.
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Mike 04:16 PM 06-20-2016
Sounds to me like that place should be reported. Definitely fishy.
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Blackcat31 04:27 PM 06-20-2016
Originally Posted by Rnkyl:
This happened last week, Tuesday. After calling and leaving messages at the center and the owner's cellular phone a number of time through the remainder of the week, I finally managed to get a hold of the owner today and have a meeting with them tomorrow morning. Sadly, I'm told the video feed system they have is on a 5 day loop, so being able to see what happened is not a possibility since it records over itself after 5 days. I'm a bit confused and wanted to see the altercation since there is conflicting stories between what staff says and what my son and daughter says. Did talk to them separately to see if their story was the same.

As far as the center's response is concerned, they expelled him that day. The staff present that day is on vacation and hadnt put a written report in. This and the lack of video feed is concerning to me, because the side of the story that I am hearing from my children is that another child provoked my son by pushing him in his face and that the staff member was rather rough and slammed my child down in a chair hard enough that the other children could hear it from the other room. He did have some light pressure marks on his legs that faded the next day.

I am trying not to jump to conclusions and make a determination without all the facts present, but it does seem a bit convenient that I couldn't get in touch with the owner/manager until after the video loop 5 day time passed and the staff member is on vacation, but only gave a verbal report and not a written.
But thats the thing... Not allowing him to eat is NEVER okay regardless of what they think he did or didnt do. He's 4. Even inmates in a correctional facilty arent denied food.

I agree with Mike.. Report this center.
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AmyKidsCo 08:11 PM 06-20-2016
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
But thats the thing... Not allowing him to eat is NEVER okay regardless of what they think he did or didnt do. He's 4. Even inmates in a correctional facilty arent denied food.

I agree with Mike.. Report this center.
Ditto. In each of the 3 states that I've done regulated care in there's a rule against withholding food. Not to mention it's unethical.
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spedmommy4 04:53 AM 06-21-2016
Here is a photo of the Idaho regulations. The staff are not permitted to withhold food as punishment. I'm betting they know the staff messed up and that's why the footage of the incident is no longer available. In your shoes, I would report. They need to retrain their staff to ensure this doesn't happen again.
Attached: image.jpg (10.7 KB) 
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Cat Herder 05:25 AM 06-21-2016
Not defending the place but it is possible that they sent him to the kitchen because that worker liked him. When I ran the kitchen, once upon a time, I was often sent "unruly preschool boys" because they were my favorite and I worked particularly well with them. They were in the dining area, at tables, with science projects from my home, not the actual kitchen.

IMHO, that is the person you should consult with if possible since that (behavioral modification) is obviously also part of his/her job description.

Withholding food is illegal. Period.

It is possible he was fed but did not get to participate in "lunch". The class process of lunch is not the same as eating to kids. "Hey Johnny, what did you have for lunch?" *Nothing* "Oh, you must be so hungry. Are you ready for dinner?." *Not yet, they gave us huge sandwiches and fruit at the pool.* Been there... two sons, myself.

I know it may be too late to change this situation, I really hope for the best outcome and hope they were not ugly to him.
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daycarediva 09:33 AM 06-23-2016
Originally Posted by Rnkyl:
This happened last week, Tuesday. After calling and leaving messages at the center and the owner's cellular phone a number of time through the remainder of the week, I finally managed to get a hold of the owner today and have a meeting with them tomorrow morning. Sadly, I'm told the video feed system they have is on a 5 day loop, so being able to see what happened is not a possibility since it records over itself after 5 days. I'm a bit confused and wanted to see the altercation since there is conflicting stories between what staff says and what my son and daughter says. Did talk to them separately to see if their story was the same.

As far as the center's response is concerned, they expelled him that day. The staff present that day is on vacation and hadnt put a written report in. This and the lack of video feed is concerning to me, because the side of the story that I am hearing from my children is that another child provoked my son by pushing him in his face and that the staff member was rather rough and slammed my child down in a chair hard enough that the other children could hear it from the other room. He did have some light pressure marks on his legs that faded the next day.

I am trying not to jump to conclusions and make a determination without all the facts present, but it does seem a bit convenient that I couldn't get in touch with the owner/manager until after the video loop 5 day time passed and the staff member is on vacation, but only gave a verbal report and not a written.
It seems that the timing of the video feeds and the long response from the director was no coincidence. It sounds like your son was mistreated and they attempted to blame your son and cover their tracks.

Neither of my children would be going back and I would be reporting it to CPS and the licensing agent immediately.
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sleepinghart 03:45 AM 06-24-2016
Originally Posted by Rnkyl:
This happened last week, Tuesday. After calling and leaving messages at the center and the owner's cellular phone a number of time through the remainder of the week, I finally managed to get a hold of the owner today and have a meeting with them tomorrow morning. Sadly, I'm told the video feed system they have is on a 5 day loop, so being able to see what happened is not a possibility since it records over itself after 5 days. I'm a bit confused and wanted to see the altercation since there is conflicting stories between what staff says and what my son and daughter says. Did talk to them separately to see if their story was the same.

As far as the center's response is concerned, they expelled him that day. The staff present that day is on vacation and hadnt put a written report in. This and the lack of video feed is concerning to me, because the side of the story that I am hearing from my children is that another child provoked my son by pushing him in his face and that the staff member was rather rough and slammed my child down in a chair hard enough that the other children could hear it from the other room. He did have some light pressure marks on his legs that faded the next day.

I am trying not to jump to conclusions and make a determination without all the facts present, but it does seem a bit convenient that I couldn't get in touch with the owner/manager until after the video loop 5 day time passed and the staff member is on vacation, but only gave a verbal report and not a written.
(^^bolded^^ by me)
~By 'conflicting', are they(the staff) denying food was withheld period, or something else?

~Any updates?

~Also, if you haven't said already, and if you don't mind my asking, what was the reason given to you as to why they expelled your son that day?
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Tags:punishment, punishment - food
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