Daycare.com Forum

Go Back   Daycare.com Forum > Parents and Guardians Forum

Parents and Guardians Forum Parents and Guardians should post and answer questions here.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-08-2016, 08:42 PM
User_Name's Avatar
User_Name User_Name is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1
Question Daycare Provider Refutes Pediatrician EVERY TIME

I want to start by saying our daycare provider is wonderful in every way but this one. I understand it is an extremely difficult job taking care of several other people's children all day. Long hours and the inability to truly leave work (home daycare) has got to be a huge downside to the job (although there are a lot of upsides )

We have been called to pick up our child several times when he was displaying symptoms and she instructed us to take him to the doctor for a diagnosis. Completely reasonable. But when we come back and tell her that there is nothing seriously wrong or contagious, or that her suspicion of what the illness was was incorrect, she gets really defensive and sometimes argumentative. I understand she wants all her kids to be healthy and they shouldn't come to daycare if they're ill, but our pediatrician has been in practice for almost 40 years and for her to refute his diagnoses is not only foolish but unprofessional. We've only been going here for about a year, and already she has done this at least three times. I want to tell her in a nice way that she is not a doctor and should not get defensive, and she needs to trust our pediatrician's expertise. Or should we find care elsewhere?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 12-09-2016, 02:27 AM
Josiegirl's Avatar
Josiegirl Josiegirl is online now
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Right here
Posts: 5,837
Default

Was your child able to participate in a normal routine? That has a lot to do with it also. If 1 dck is holding everyone else back from going outdoors, etc., a provider has to think about what's best for the group.
I'm sure your pedi can be trusted if you're comfortable enough with him/her and as much as I always trusted my own kids' pedi, there were times when he told me children diagnosed with pinkeye(or other things) could attend my daycare. I'm sorry but I do NOT want something like that running amok through 6 kids AND their families. I took care of a doctor's dd who got sick and my own dd, at 18 mo, contracted bronchiolitis from her, spending 2 nights in the hospital. I remember the dr.(my dcm) coming into the ER while we were there and asking me if I'd be going back home to open dc so she could bring her dd back.
If I'd known then what I know now.
Your provider has the final say as to whether or not your child needs to be excluded from her home dc. You either trust her and have reliable back-up or find someone else. That is your decision alone.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-09-2016, 03:10 AM
Play Care's Avatar
Play Care Play Care is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Upstate NY
Posts: 6,165
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Josiegirl View Post
Was your child able to participate in a normal routine? That has a lot to do with it also. If 1 dck is holding everyone else back from going outdoors, etc., a provider has to think about what's best for the group.
I'm sure your pedi can be trusted if you're comfortable enough with him/her and as much as I always trusted my own kids' pedi, there were times when he told me children diagnosed with pinkeye(or other things) could attend my daycare. I'm sorry but I do NOT want something like that running amok through 6 kids AND their families. I took care of a doctor's dd who got sick and my own dd, at 18 mo, contracted bronchiolitis from her, spending 2 nights in the hospital. I remember the dr.(my dcm) coming into the ER while we were there and asking me if I'd be going back home to open dc so she could bring her dd back.
If I'd known then what I know now.
Your provider has the final say as to whether or not your child needs to be excluded from her home dc. You either trust her and have reliable back-up or find someone else. That is your decision alone.


Several providers on this board have a policy that they do not accept a doctor's note for "return to care" because often doctors think minor illnesses are "no big deal." However a child who is even mildly ill can often be quite needy, making it impossible for the provider to care for other children.

One time I had a toddler who kept having major, blow out diarrhea. The doctor claimed it was a reaction to something he ate and not contagious, therefore he could be at day care. Um, no. I called for pick up after having to clean/sanitize him, toys, carpet, furniture, OTHER CHILDREN, etc.

In my case I wasn't refuting the doctor's diagnosis, just being clear that I wasn't going to be managing it.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 12-09-2016, 04:49 AM
childcaremom's Avatar
childcaremom childcaremom is online now
New Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 2,779
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Play Care View Post


Several providers on this board have a policy that they do not accept a doctor's note for "return to care" because often doctors think minor illnesses are "no big deal." However a child who is even mildly ill can often be quite needy, making it impossible for the provider to care for other children.

One time I had a toddler who kept having major, blow out diarrhea. The doctor claimed it was a reaction to something he ate and not contagious, therefore he could be at day care. Um, no. I called for pick up after having to clean/sanitize him, toys, carpet, furniture, OTHER CHILDREN, etc.

In my case I wasn't refuting the doctor's diagnosis, just being clear that I wasn't going to be managing it.


I agree. I will take what a doctor says into consideration but ultimately I have the final say on whether a child is able to return to care.

I exclude for symptoms. So regardless of the 'why' or the diagnosis, if they are exhibiting symptoms, then a child may not return to care. I will often ask for a diagnosis to help in monitoring the rest of the group and making decisions for the well being of the group as a whole. A recurrent cough due to a mild cold is different from one due to allergies is different from one due to a developing respiratory infection. Just an example. I'm not sure specifically what issues you are dealing with.

Also, daycare is not home and oftentimes a child is able to cope with a minor illness more easily at home then in a daycare environment. so while a symptom may not seem like a huge deal at home, add in 4-5 other children (or more) and a busy, on the go, environment, and that mild/non-contagious symptom is magnified.

OP, if everything else is working well and you are happy with your provider, I suggest having a discussion about this during a period of time when your child is not sick so that emotions are not running high. Perhaps even an opener such as: Dcp, I know you requested a diagnosis for Susan's cough last week. Can you explain your policy about this a bit for me? I'm unclear as to the reasoning for it.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-09-2016, 05:08 AM
Blackcat31's Avatar
Blackcat31 Blackcat31 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 21,908
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by User_Name View Post
I want to start by saying our daycare provider is wonderful in every way but this one. I understand it is an extremely difficult job taking care of several other people's children all day. Long hours and the inability to truly leave work (home daycare) has got to be a huge downside to the job (although there are a lot of upsides )

We have been called to pick up our child several times when he was displaying symptoms and she instructed us to take him to the doctor for a diagnosis. Completely reasonable. But when we come back and tell her that there is nothing seriously wrong or contagious, or that her suspicion of what the illness was was incorrect, she gets really defensive and sometimes argumentative. I understand she wants all her kids to be healthy and they shouldn't come to daycare if they're ill, but our pediatrician has been in practice for almost 40 years and for her to refute his diagnoses is not only foolish but unprofessional. We've only been going here for about a year, and already she has done this at least three times. I want to tell her in a nice way that she is not a doctor and should not get defensive, and she needs to trust our pediatrician's expertise. Or should we find care elsewhere?
What symptoms exactly is she seeing that prompts her to call for pick up? Can you share an example or two of what the provider said she is seeing as far as symptoms and what your actions were in regards to that.....

How old is your child? Self-pay or state assistance?
Are you a full time family or a part time family?
How many other children are in the provider's care?

I understand your dilemma but I suspect there are two different lines of thought happening here and before offering advice or commenting, I'd need to know more details of what is happening.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-09-2016, 05:55 AM
Mad_Pistachio's Avatar
Mad_Pistachio Mad_Pistachio is online now
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 324
Default

sometimes a child has nothing serious and not contagious, but is so miserable that all s/he has is to lay on a mat in a corner due to fatigue.

my daughter went to daycare with pneumonia that manifested itself as an occasional cough. no fever, nothing. goodness, I wish we took her in earlier... now, I have no idea how she was there, but I was not called for pickup (they almost never do), and again, I wish I was.
but sometimes her colds are so irritating that we keep her home because her nose is running out of control, and she sneezes snot 5 feet down. I don't want her to cover the DC area in snot, it's just gross.

so it really depends on how your child handles the everyday activities at the daycare. a pneumonia may look like nothing serious, and a child is acting fine, while a runny nose can ruin the whole day.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-09-2016, 07:05 AM
Leigh's Avatar
Leigh Leigh is online now
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 2,927
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by User_Name View Post
I want to start by saying our daycare provider is wonderful in every way but this one. I understand it is an extremely difficult job taking care of several other people's children all day. Long hours and the inability to truly leave work (home daycare) has got to be a huge downside to the job (although there are a lot of upsides )

We have been called to pick up our child several times when he was displaying symptoms and she instructed us to take him to the doctor for a diagnosis. Completely reasonable. But when we come back and tell her that there is nothing seriously wrong or contagious, or that her suspicion of what the illness was was incorrect, she gets really defensive and sometimes argumentative. I understand she wants all her kids to be healthy and they shouldn't come to daycare if they're ill, but our pediatrician has been in practice for almost 40 years and for her to refute his diagnoses is not only foolish but unprofessional. We've only been going here for about a year, and already she has done this at least three times. I want to tell her in a nice way that she is not a doctor and should not get defensive, and she needs to trust our pediatrician's expertise. Or should we find care elsewhere?
I have to agree with the others about symptoms being the reason for exclusion regardless of diagnosis or a doctor saying the child is not contagious. Just a month ago, I had a doctor write a "return to daycare" note for a child just diagnosed with strep throat. This child had a twin who was not diagnosed. I KNEW the twin would also have it, and the twin DID also have it. Mom was angry that I wouldn't allow the kids back at daycare immediately after diagnosis with that stupid note from the doctor, but common sense tells me that the twin will also get the illness, and I have THREE immune compromised kids in daycare to protect, as well as myself (If I get sick, then NO ONE gets daycare services until I'm better). 1 of those kids in my care could be hospitalized or worse from strep.

Doctors write notes to allow sick kids back at school or childcare every day. If YOUR child caught the illness, it is contagious. Many doctors feel that it's good to expose kids to these illnesses to build immunity and don't see a reason to keep them away from other kids. As providers, we have to protect ourselves and the kids in our care from these reckless decisions made by doctors that can expose vulnerable children to illness and to protect our own businesses by excluding kids with symptoms so that WE can continue to work.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 12-09-2016, 08:55 AM
daycarediva's Avatar
daycarediva daycarediva is online now
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 8,703
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Play Care View Post


Several providers on this board have a policy that they do not accept a doctor's note for "return to care" because often doctors think minor illnesses are "no big deal." However a child who is even mildly ill can often be quite needy, making it impossible for the provider to care for other children.

One time I had a toddler who kept having major, blow out diarrhea. The doctor claimed it was a reaction to something he ate and not contagious, therefore he could be at day care. Um, no. I called for pick up after having to clean/sanitize him, toys, carpet, furniture, OTHER CHILDREN, etc.

In my case I wasn't refuting the doctor's diagnosis, just being clear that I wasn't going to be managing it.
I agree with this. I don't refute a dr's diagnosis, but I do NOT allow a doctor to dictate when/if a child can be in care. I exclude for symptoms, and not diagnosis.

I would need more details to know her train of thought and give further advice, but I suspect that's what is happening. Child is unable to participate, exceptionally fussy, (even mildly ill children who are not contagious can have great difficulty in group care while feeling poorly.

I had a dr say a child with pink eye could return to care before the prescription was filled. The school district has also lightened up on policies regarding strep, flu, fevers (they allow up to 102 before calling) lice-they allow nits AND active lice, can you imagine having that in daycare!? EEK!

So yes, my policies for small children are much more stringent and symptom, not diagnosis based.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 12-09-2016, 11:01 AM
nanglgrl's Avatar
nanglgrl nanglgrl is online now
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Iowa
Posts: 1,533
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by daycarediva View Post
I agree with this. I don't refute a dr's diagnosis, but I do NOT allow a doctor to dictate when/if a child can be in care. I exclude for symptoms, and not diagnosis.

I would need more details to know her train of thought and give further advice, but I suspect that's what is happening. Child is unable to participate, exceptionally fussy, (even mildly ill children who are not contagious can have great difficulty in group care while feeling poorly.

I had a dr say a child with pink eye could return to care before the prescription was filled. The school district has also lightened up on policies regarding strep, flu, fevers (they allow up to 102 before calling) lice-they allow nits AND active lice, can you imagine having that in daycare!? EEK!

So yes, my policies for small children are much more stringent and symptom, not diagnosis based.
I don't think most people realize that just because a school allows something doesn't mean a daycare provider should. Schoolagers are older and while they do spread illness they are more likely to wash hands, cover coughs, not mouth items etc. than an infant/toddler so they are less likely to spread it. Once that stuff comes into a daycare it's a pretty safe bet that the majority will get it. There's also a good chance the provider will get it and should close because watching children takes a lot of energy and has a lot of liability. You need to be feeling well and have a clear head to react quickly, take care of basic needs and interact.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-08-2017, 07:31 PM
Meeko's Avatar
Meeko Meeko is online now
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Utah
Posts: 3,824
Default

My daycare is for healthy kids. Our schedule is very active and busy. A child who is feeling under the weather cannot keep up with our schedule and needs to be at home.

Just because the doctor says they aren't contagious doesn't mean they are fit enough to return. The doctor has no idea how I run things in my home, so he has no say so in who attends and who is excluded.

Some parents feel that doctor "beats" provider. Sorry....my house, my rules.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 01-17-2017, 04:38 PM
Mom2Two's Avatar
Mom2Two Mom2Two is online now
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: U. S. A.
Posts: 358
Default

Maybe it's partly a communication problem. If daycare provider sounds like she's promising that your child can return if the doctor says it's okay then maybe the communication isn't quite perfect.

Having been on both sides of this, I can say that pediatricians sometimes seem to be thinking that the if the illness isn't likely to start a pandemic, they don't feel that they have to recommend that a child be excluded. But that's different from a business owner making the call to exclude.

As others have said, young, sick kids can be pretty needy even if they aren't a public health risk, and also illnesses go around a daycare very fast, which causes other families to be affected too.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 01-24-2017, 06:05 PM
hwichlaz's Avatar
hwichlaz hwichlaz is online now
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: California
Posts: 151
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mom2Two View Post
Maybe it's partly a communication problem. If daycare provider sounds like she's promising that your child can return if the doctor says it's okay then maybe the communication isn't quite perfect.

Having been on both sides of this, I can say that pediatricians sometimes seem to be thinking that the if the illness isn't likely to start a pandemic, they don't feel that they have to recommend that a child be excluded. But that's different from a business owner making the call to exclude.

As others have said, young, sick kids can be pretty needy even if they aren't a public health risk, and also illnesses go around a daycare very fast, which causes other families to be affected too.
YES THIS, also....doctors know zilch about daycare regulations. Sometimes our regulations for what we can allow in care don't jive with the doctor's opinion.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
argumentative, attendance policy, diagnosis, doctor, doctor's note, dr, dr., exclusion policy, illness, mistrust, sent home, sick policy, sickness, unprofessional

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Tips for Provider Burn Out Blackcat31 Daycare Center and Family Home Forum 29 01-06-2017 01:51 PM
Daycare Provider Terminated My Child And Is Charging Me For Not Returning aer523235 Daycare Center and Family Home Forum 34 05-05-2016 11:03 AM
Do You Tell Clients The Provider/Parents/Children's Rights During An Interview? Starburst Daycare Center and Family Home Forum 11 01-10-2013 10:09 AM
Policies - Suggestions? Unregistered Daycare Center and Family Home Forum 2 10-23-2012 05:12 AM
Daycare Family Trying To Re-Collect Money Owed To A Provider! Unregistered Daycare Center and Family Home Forum 46 02-22-2011 10:30 AM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 09:22 PM.



Daycare.com         Find A Daycare         List Your Daycare         Toys & Products                 About Us

Daycare.com
Please read our Disclaimer before continuing.

Topics pertain mainly to the following States:

Alabama Alaska Arizona Arkansas California Colorado Connecticut Delaware District of Columbia Florida Georgia Hawaii Idaho Illinois Indiana Iowa Kansas Kentucky Louisiana Maine Maryland Massachusetts Michigan Minnesota Mississippi Missouri Montana Nebraska Nevada New Hampshire New Jersey New Mexico New York North Carolina North Dakota Ohio Oklahoma Oregon Pennsylvania Rhode Island South Carolina South Dakota Tennessee Texas Utah Vermont Virginia Washington West Virginia Wisconsin Wyoming