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  #1  
Old 09-24-2007, 05:15 PM
amandak amandak is offline
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Default Religion Within the Daycare

I recently started working at a daycare in nj. i was not aware that is was a religiously affiliated facility until after i started, when i was told to do a morning prayer with the children. i am an atheist and was a bit startled by this task. i had no problem monitoring the childrens' praying and was not forced to pray, myself. the following day, i was approached by my boss and asked "if i knew god" and was told that by the end of my time at the daycare, i would be introduced to religion. i was extremely uncomfortable and made her aware that i was not okay with this. i'm worried about how to handle the situation if it gets brought up again. is it legal for her to, for lack of a better word, force religion on an employee? i love the job but would not be willing to stay if there was any legal way that i could be forced into a religious setting.

Last edited by amandak; 09-24-2007 at 05:17 PM.
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  #2  
Old 09-24-2007, 06:46 PM
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Lightbulb Atheist In a Religious Daycare - Religious Harassment

This employer is obviously ignorant of state and federal law.

Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of l964 prohibits employers from discriminating against individuals because of their religion in hiring, firing, and other terms and conditions of employment. Title VII covers employers with 15 or more employees, including state and local governments. It also applies to employment agencies and to labor organizations, as well as to the federal government. http://eeoc.gov/types/religion.html

Some examples of religious harassment:

Religious harassment involves unwelcome and religiously offensive conduct in the workplace. Religious harassment can include negative or offensive remarks or jokes about a person's religion or religious garments; religious slurs; or other verbal or physical conduct based on an individual's religion or religious beliefs. http://youth.eeoc.gov/religion2.html

You may wnat to make him aware of these laws. If you are terminated for any reason afterward you may to seek legal advice.
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  #3  
Old 09-25-2007, 01:54 PM
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thanks so much. this makes me feel less awkward about speaking up on this issue.
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  #4  
Old 10-04-2007, 12:35 PM
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If it is a private business, they can make this a part of their policy. they should have been up front. It sounds to me like you are just looking for something to go to court about and not really into your job at all. You should just straight up ask your boss if they want to accept you or not. Personally, I would not want your influence in my day care, but I also advertise that I am a Christian day care. Maybe you just failed to recognise this, or you went into this job knowing, and just looking to try to change someone elses business because you don't like it being christian. I wouldn't want to come against God's anointed if I were you. You better be careful how you handle this, God protects His own.
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  #5  
Old 10-05-2007, 09:46 AM
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Talking

"god protects his own"...what a wackjob. surprise.....there is no god!
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  #6  
Old 10-05-2007, 11:34 AM
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I'm sorry you feel this way. Some day you will come to the realization that God is real. I just hope that you realize this before it is too late. God is real, and He does protect Hs own. Maybe not the way your carnal mind has been programed to understand. Don't close your mind until you at least learn about it.
When I don't believe something, I don't close my mind off until I have studied it out. Sometimes I have been wrong. I'm not wrong about God.
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  #7  
Old 10-05-2007, 11:57 AM
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Lightbulb God in Place

I know this is a site about childcare but here is my opinion. Everyone is in different stages of understanding. Until someone can tell me how from nothing (a void with no space, no thought, no substance) that something can make life, harmony, love, thought, emotion and everything working cohesively on a molecular and atomic level. Whatever can do this, is my God and is one heck of a Creator.
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  #8  
Old 12-14-2007, 06:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered
If it is a private business, they can make this a part of their policy. they should have been up front. It sounds to me like you are just looking for something to go to court about and not really into your job at all. You should just straight up ask your boss if they want to accept you or not. Personally, I would not want your influence in my day care, but I also advertise that I am a Christian day care. Maybe you just failed to recognise this, or you went into this job knowing, and just looking to try to change someone elses business because you don't like it being christian. I wouldn't want to come against God's anointed if I were you. You better be careful how you handle this, God protects His own.


Are you kidding me?! I am a christian and I cannot stand it when I see other people so quick to jump on anyone who does not claim God! First of all when you threaten people, you are not practicing what the word teaches. Second of all, if your whole speel was to try and testify, then you did a bad job at it. God says to obey man's law! That includes her boss. These laws are there to protect everyone- I would not like it if I worked for someone who was Buddhist and my boss tried to convert me. And just for the record, I would not want someone so judgemental watching my children! I hope that someday she would come to God, but that is her choice and her's alone.

Last edited by Michael; 12-14-2007 at 11:06 AM.
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  #9  
Old 03-02-2009, 01:21 PM
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Thumbs down

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
If it is a private business, they can make this a part of their policy. they should have been up front. It sounds to me like you are just looking for something to go to court about and not really into your job at all. You should just straight up ask your boss if they want to accept you or not. Personally, I would not want your influence in my day care, but I also advertise that I am a Christian day care. Maybe you just failed to recognise this, or you went into this job knowing, and just looking to try to change someone elses business because you don't like it being christian. I wouldn't want to come against God's anointed if I were you. You better be careful how you handle this, God protects His own.
You know she posted her question on her for help not a sermon. Lady if your all about sermons be a preachers wife and lay off the people who actaully care about the children's help more then if they pray everyday.
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  #10  
Old 03-03-2009, 12:35 PM
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Default lost for words

OK how bout this.........daycare provider cared for this child for over 2 years now and parents just now let the provider know that it is against their religious belief to get their children their immunizations? For 2 years these parents have exposed not only the children in her care but her family as well? What would ya'll do?

Last edited by Michael; 03-03-2009 at 01:31 PM.
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  #11  
Old 03-03-2009, 08:33 PM
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Post immunizations

She's supposed to have immunization records for every child she cares for before they even start. That's the childcare providers responsibility to get from the parents...It's possible that if the parents weren't asked for them in the beginning they assumed they wouldn't be obligated to provide proof of immunizations. And I have to believe that these parents weren't asked for them at the start of care, otherwise this conversation about religion and immunizations between the parents and provider would've taken place two years ago. I believe parents are allowed to sign a waiver saying they choose not to get their child/ren immunized for their own reasons but again, it's something the provider should have gone over a long time ago to avoid these kinds of complications 2 years after everyone has been exposed.
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  #12  
Old 06-02-2009, 01:11 AM
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Default Pa- leez

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
If it is a private business, they can make this a part of their policy. they should have been up front. It sounds to me like you are just looking for something to go to court about and not really into your job at all. You should just straight up ask your boss if they want to accept you or not. Personally, I would not want your influence in my day care, but I also advertise that I am a Christian day care. Maybe you just failed to recognise this, or you went into this job knowing, and just looking to try to change someone elses business because you don't like it being christian. I wouldn't want to come against God's anointed if I were you. You better be careful how you handle this, God protects His own.
Get off your self righteous high horse.... I beleive in God that is in Heaven,but guess what, I also happen to be very uncomfortable with any school, or daycare provider that has any kind of religion,because my religion is quite different, Most of the time ,what is being taught (like how to pray,etc..) is not what i am teaching my own kids. SO , I would be just as uncomfortable as a atheist,even though I believe in God. I too,used to work in a "christian" daycare and was completely unaware of it until I noticed them praying at lunch time. It worked out for me though and there was no conflict. They were understanding and I communicated /offered solutions that wokred for us both.
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  #13  
Old 06-05-2009, 11:24 AM
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Default Sorry...

I am a card carrying atheist, and I'm sorry, but it's just not possible that you had no idea that this was a Christian daycare. More than people who try to force religion down my throat, I don't like fellow atheists who try to stir the pot. This is probably a privately run or not-for-profit daycare, so good luck suing them when they fire you for not being religious. Keeping religion out of public government and schools (except for the tokens that are leftovers from history) should be our focus, not irritating private institutions like this. What you are basically doing is throwing your crap at a small place that is just trying to provide good care for kids. It's up to the parents who take their kids to this place if it's religious or not, not you. All you'll end up doing is driving up prices and driving down quality of care because you're so focused on your own 'issues.' This is about kids. If you can't handle that, then get out of child care. Or go to a for profit center that specializes in non-religious care.
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  #14  
Old 10-15-2009, 10:52 AM
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Smile Religion in daycare

I believe God must have ordered your steps to that day care for you to see the need you have in your life . You need Jesus as your Savior not only does God exist but also has a plan of salvatin for you . I advise you to pocket your pride of being an atheist and approach the director for a better understanding of who Jesus is. Jesus loves you
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  #15  
Old 10-19-2009, 11:46 AM
jen jen is offline
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Hellooo...

I'm sorry, but that is like working at a meat packing plant and then refusing to touch the meat because you are a vegatrian! You don't have to mean the prayer, but the parents who sent their kids there did so in order to give them a Christian education, so either buck up or get out.
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  #16  
Old 10-19-2009, 11:50 AM
jen jen is offline
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Well, thats nice. Because you can threaten someone to believe in God...seriously shush, you are giving Christians a bad name...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
If it is a private business, they can make this a part of their policy. they should have been up front. It sounds to me like you are just looking for something to go to court about and not really into your job at all. You should just straight up ask your boss if they want to accept you or not. Personally, I would not want your influence in my day care, but I also advertise that I am a Christian day care. Maybe you just failed to recognise this, or you went into this job knowing, and just looking to try to change someone elses business because you don't like it being christian. I wouldn't want to come against God's anointed if I were you. You better be careful how you handle this, God protects His own.
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  #17  
Old 10-20-2009, 03:07 PM
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Exclamation immunizations

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
OK how bout this.........daycare provider cared for this child for over 2 years now and parents just now let the provider know that it is against their religious belief to get their children their immunizations? For 2 years these parents have exposed not only the children in her care but her family as well? What would ya'll do?
I require proof of immunizations before care is given...PERIOD! IT is also the law in IOWA!
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  #18  
Old 10-20-2009, 06:22 PM
GretasLittleFriends GretasLittleFriends is offline
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In Minnesota, the state gives the daycare a form that needs to be filled out and signed by the parents (and the doctor if under the age of 15 or 18 months). The parent has the option to choose to not have their child immunized. If the parent chooses this option they have to have the form notarized. It is also a right of the daycare provider to choose to not to accept this child for not being immunized. We are not allowed to discriminate against race, religion, etc, the one difference being we can choose NOT to accept children who have not been immunized.
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  #19  
Old 10-20-2009, 06:45 PM
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I am not sure but in TX if a parent brings in a document from the state saying that the parent is choosing not to have the immunizations because of religious reasons, and it is signed, sealed, notarized etc..then that its ok. However, if I am not mistaken, once the child reaches school age, then they have to get the required shots.

Again, I am not sure but if it is true, that's good ole licensing for you! I agree with tinytotz. It should be REQUIRED. We are all protecting each other. If someone doesn't want a shot, go live in Siberia!
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  #20  
Old 10-20-2009, 07:17 PM
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Default immunizations

Quote:
Originally Posted by Former Teacher View Post
I am not sure but in TX if a parent brings in a document from the state saying that the parent is choosing not to have the immunizations because of religious reasons, and it is signed, sealed, notarized etc..then that its ok. However, if I am not mistaken, once the child reaches school age, then they have to get the required shots.

Again, I am not sure but if it is true, that's good ole licensing for you! I agree with tinytotz. It should be REQUIRED. We are all protecting each other. If someone doesn't want a shot, go live in Siberia!
OUrs is the same as well, its required unless they have the proper paperwork signed that gives them right not to...but in my daycare..ITS A MUST..PERIOD!
I have to look out for my family as well!
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  #21  
Old 10-21-2009, 05:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tinytotzdaycare View Post
OUrs is the same as well, its required unless they have the proper paperwork signed that gives them right not to...but in my daycare..ITS A MUST..PERIOD!
I have to look out for my family as well!
I hear ya!! I wish all centers, home etc, would be firm like you. My former center included haha
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  #22  
Old 10-21-2009, 10:30 AM
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Default Not quite...

Quote:
Originally Posted by jen View Post
Hellooo...

I'm sorry, but that is like working at a meat packing plant and then refusing to touch the meat because you are a vegatrian! You don't have to mean the prayer, but the parents who sent their kids there did so in order to give them a Christian education, so either buck up or get out.
The only center I could find in my area that was acceptable to me (clean, safe, loving, etc) and would provide transportation to/from school happens to be a Methodist church. Personally, I am Wiccan, but choose to raise my children to be educated about all faiths and open minded. While I like the fact that the church dc is providing some education about the bible, I don't care for the way they are teaching my children to pray. I don't interfere with they way they run the dc, nor do I ask that they not have my children participate in prayer (we kind of just roll with it). My point is that just because I send my kids there, doesn't mean that I want them to have a christian education... it's pretty much my only choice
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  #23  
Old 10-21-2009, 12:40 PM
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Question Just a Question about Denomination

Would you be more comfortable if you had the option of Christian classes or non Christian classes would you feel better about taking your child to a Methodist church daycare?
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  #24  
Old 10-26-2009, 11:41 AM
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Default "Non-Christian"?

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Originally Posted by AnjelWings72@yahoo View Post
Would you be more comfortable if you had the option of Christian classes or non Christian classes would you feel better about taking your child to a Methodist church daycare?
My thinking is that my children are getting a much better education on religion than I ever had growing up. Everything they are being taught is positive. (aside from the cultural garbage they would be exposed to anywhere out here anyway) I would prefer for their heads not to be filled with fire and brimstone and whatnot. Yes, I would prefer them not to be so conflicted as to have people tell them (should they feel the need to share that 'mommy is a witch') that their mommy is evil, but we live in the south--that's going to happen anywhere. The environment is loving and safe and (so far as I can see) non-judgemental. So--given the option of having all of that in a non-religious atmosphere, I would prefer it, but the option isn't present for me. Bottom line is, they are being taught love and respect from two different viewpoints (mine and that of the church day care), so hopefully this will lead them to have open and loving minds as they grow.
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  #25  
Old 11-13-2009, 09:55 AM
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It is their business. Maybe they should have been more up front with you. But it's up to you if you want to stay or not you have only been there one day and looking to go to court already. I would just move on if its something that really bugs you. Starting a job at a Christian daycare then taking them to court for praying, give me a break.

GrandmaPenny
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  #26  
Old 01-25-2010, 07:20 AM
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Regarding immunizations, MN law requires immunizations, or that the parent sign an objection based on faith to immunizations. I will only ever have one family of non-immunized conscientious objectors, and not when I have infants who can't be immunized, to prevent the spread of infectious disease.
For the lady with the employment issue: I'm not certain of the details of the law in your state, however, if the daycare is in a church or part of a church, or listed when they applied for their license as a Christian Daycare they are legally allowed preferential hiring to Christians, as understanding and holding those beliefs would be necessary to do the job. Would a Catholic School hire a Buddhist Monk for Catechism classes? You are entitled to your religious beliefs, or lack thereof, it is America, after all. That daycare is also entitled as a Christian Daycare, to teach its basic beliefs as part of their program. Was there no hint in the name or environment that they had Christian principles? Perhaps a Noah's Ark Poster, poem on the wall or artwork hanging up, that could have indicated the type of place it was? Personally I know it can be a challenge as a Christian in any workplace around non-Christians and maintaining my faith and principles without being attacked as a fruitcake. At least within professed Christian establishments they are free to express their faith. If you are uncomfortable, the job is not a good fit and you should pursue a job in a secular business or school district run facility with a distinct separation, where your lack of faith is more of an asset. I personally run a home daycare that is state licensed, therefore cannot discriminate regarding clients or employees for any reason, including religion. Nonetheless, it is my own home and I raised my children here, so I make it clear during interviews and in my policies that as such my son prays before meals, and we have both secular and non secular books and displays surrounding religious holidays, etc. I encourage the families to discuss with me their comfort level, and personal beliefs so we can be respectful to them, as I expect them to be respectful to me. I have had Hindus, Buddhists and Jews here, and we have all managed to get along, and hopefully children learning to coexist peacefully in this environment helps them on a larger scale in adult life. I believe my profession is my calling, and I do it as a service to God, and my faith gives me strength and compasssion and love to do my job. My father was an atheist, and I have known many. In my experience many (not all) of them had negative experiences with professed Christians, or severe hardships in their life that made it difficult to believe. I have had both in my life, and understand the mindset, (and heartset) that make it difficult to interact peacefully with believers. Unfortunately non-believers use the human weaknesses that everyone has, Christians included, as a weapon against faith and the faithful. Having sin or weakness does not make a Christian a hypocrite, it makes them a sinner, human, as we all are. Hopefully all who have participated in this discussion will try to examine their motives and speech. Regardless of the integrity of a Christian's intentions, their actions and speech will always be scrutinized through the looking glass of the non- believer and be found wanting. While our faith requires us to be "fishers of men" and profess and try to spread our faith, make sure we do it in love, not with the fear and defensiveness that allows our speech to amplify negative emotions. Likewise non-believers who wish their freedom and fear the "judgement" that they feel comes with religion, should at least respect the right to our beliefs and speech on our beliefs, the same as all other faiths and athiests alike, share in our society. At least being willing to learn and understand about other cultures and belief systems allows for a more peaceful coexistence.
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  #27  
Old 01-25-2010, 07:55 AM
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Default I Must Agree

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Are you kidding me?! I am a christian and I cannot stand it when I see other people so quick to jump on anyone who does not claim God! First of all when you threaten people, you are not practicing what the word teaches. Second of all, if your whole speel was to try and testify, then you did a bad job at it. God says to obey man's law! That includes her boss. These laws are there to protect everyone- I would not like it if I worked for someone who was Buddhist and my boss tried to convert me. And just for the record, I would not want someone so judgemental watching my children! I hope that someday she would come to God, but that is her choice and her's alone.
I must agree with this. Condemning another human being for not believing as you do isn't the way to convince them lol. Why on earth would anyone want part of something that causes people to reach out with such contempt and anger? The answer is, they wouldn't. We're supposed to bring light and salt to the earth, not fire and brimstone.

Check your heart, and see if your post lines up with what Christ calls us to be.

In the meantime, to the original poster:

I would look for another center to work at. It is not ethical for your boss to not be up-front about your job duties with regards to the praying and other religious aspects of your day-to-day involvement with the children. I'm not sure where this falls in the law-related aspects since it is a private business, although I would think that if religion were at the root of the center, it would need to be advertised as such. I think that if you were willing to monitor the prayers of the children (while not praying yourself), and that if you were willing to be respectful of the beliefs of the daycare owner and children who attend there, I don't see why you couldn't continue being employed. That is, unless your boss is like the poster up there who has already sent you straight to hell for your unbelief rather than being an example and letting God introduce himself to you .

Good luck with your situation, and I hope it works out for you!
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